| Auteur |
Onderwerp: 'Random limit per season' rule |
286 antwoorden
|
|
|
|
#1 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 17:13:21
|
Quote
|
Right now I have 3 randoms in a row and there was much more since race 12 in last season... it is frustrating cuz it is same as I don't race at all,so playing this game become same as playing poker - you need some knowledge,but in the end it's about luck . And I thought this is strategy game,not game of luck... so,we can say that promotion spots are decided before than season even start cuz in the end is only important who will have less randoms.
Now,this is not ruining just my season,but also my money. I lost sponsor because of those 3 in a row randoms without they complain at all...and there was nothing I could do to change that.
I know there will be people who will say that game is fine right now ,but those are people who had 1 random per season most so they are fine with that or those who say that game is more realistic with randoms,but don't forget this is GPRO not F1.
So I think it would be good for a game to bring rule: Random limit per season
I don't know how much,but 2 per season max sounds great.
I would like to hear what you all think about it....
|
|
|
|
|
|
#2 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 17:18:55
|
Quote
|
|
From what point is random a random and not predictable anymore ?
|
|
|
|
|
|
#3 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 17:20:39
|
Quote
|
Quote ( Mairo Toom @ December 3rd 2014,17:18:55 ) From what point is random a random and not predictable anymore ?
'One of the wheels seemed to be loose and had to be fixed', 'tire puncture',..
|
|
|
|
|
|
#4 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 17:23:00
|
Quote
|
|
There are different types of randoms and some of them can be avoided so are you saying that you got 3 unavoidable randoms 3 races in a row?
|
|
|
|
|
|
#5 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 17:26:13 (laatst aangepast Dec 3 2014, 17:26:42 door Marc Page)
|
Quote
|
Quote ( Mairo Toom @ December 3rd 2014,17:18:55 ) From what point is random a random and not predictable anymore ?
They'd still be randoms and still unpredictable. You'll either have 0, 1 or 2 randoms a season. You'll also won't know when they'll hit you, what lap, what type, etc. (unless you got your 2 already).
|
|
|
|
|
|
#6 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 17:28:12
|
Quote
|
And just to make it fair , who gets no randoms during an entire season gets those two randoms in the next one.
Oh well , counting also the other two of course.
*facepalm*
|
|
|
|
|
|
#7 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 17:29:59
|
Quote
|
Quote ( Goran Slunjski @ December 3rd 2014,17:13:21 ) Now,this is not ruining just my season,but also my money. I lost sponsor because of those 3 in a row randoms without they complain at all...and there was nothing I could do to change that. I do wish they would change this so sponsors know you had a random and negotiations carry on as normal and your current sponsors don't leave because of it.
It's like your job going "oh you broke your leg? yeah you're sacked"
|
|
|
|
|
|
#8 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 17:32:19
|
Quote
|
|
Well they did make sponsors more lenient when you get a "technical problem outside your control" back in S41. Whether that includes pure randoms, I don't know.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#9 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 17:32:55
|
Quote
|
|
They did alter the sponsor thing so not finishing a race once isn't as damaging. At least, I think thats what they did.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#10 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 17:33:04
|
Quote
|
Quote ( Sudeep Pednekar @ December 3rd 2014,17:23:00 ) There are different types of randoms and some of them can be avoided so are you saying that you got 3 unavoidable randoms 3 races in a row?
Race 12 Ahvenisto - tire puncture in lap 75
Race 13 Mugello - lap 36 smoke and acording to my calculations after that race only one part should be on 85%,nothing else higher
Race 14 Nurburgring - lap 8 'tire loose' + smoked from lap 48 and finished race with Brakes on 92% ???!
|
|
|
|
|
|
#11 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 17:37:58
|
Quote
|
Quote ( Goran Slunjski @ December 3rd 2014,17:33:04 ) Race 13 Mugello - lap 36 smoke and acording to my calculations after that race only one part should be on 85%,nothing else higher
Just because they are under 90% does not necessarily mean that won't break.
Other two are randoms, yes. And what about the brakes bit? Were they new parts?
|
|
|
|
|
|
#12 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 17:43:14
|
Quote
|
Quote ( Joe Manifold @ December 3rd 2014,17:37:58 ) Quote ( Goran Slunjski @ December 3rd 2014,17:33:04 )
Race 13 Mugello - lap 36 smoke and acording to my calculations after that race only one part should be on 85%,nothing else higher
Just because they are under 90% does not necessarily mean that won't break.
Other two are randoms, yes. And what about the brakes bit? Were they new parts?
Well,then why do we have those % for wear? if can break anytime then we don't need those numbers at all...it can break after you buy new one. I understand that after 95% or even 90% something can break,but before that for me it's random cuz it is unexpected.
And brakes wasn't new,but when some part broke on my car usually was 99% after race not 92%
|
|
|
|
|
|
#13 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 17:47:40
|
Quote
|
With the increasing levels of knowledgable managers in this game and therefore the increasing level of competition in the higher tiers, performance is getting to a point where it's determined by risks. We can only assume that "randoms" are caused by either a failing car part (untrue randoms), high risks (kind of random), or random chance (true randoms)
Since it's getting to a point where we need to use higher risks to beat our very equal opponents, we may as well call "randoms" affected by risks "true randoms" as well. Since very soon, there will be no way of avoiding using higher risks to promote from higher tiers where performance is very equal.
Saying that, randoms are indeed becoming too much a part of the game. I mean your success in Master is already only determined by your luck in pushing in qualifying. What's with all the elements of luck? The game is definitely becoming ridiculous in terms of the reliance on luck. Luck shouldn't determine who gets to elite.
So yeah I agree. A limit on randoms would be nice, and I think 3 is a reasonable amount to be able to recover from and not affect a career too badly.
Then again, I've never promoted from a higher tier so what do I know. :P
|
|
|
|
Quote ( Goran Slunjski @ December 3rd 2014,17:43:14 ) Well,then why do we have those % for wear? if can break anytime then we don't need those numbers at all...it can break after you buy new one. I understand that after 95% or even 90% something can break,but before that for me it's random cuz it is unexpected.
And brakes wasn't new,but when some part broke on my car usually was 99% after race not 92%
Well I'm sure they do say that the chance of a part breaking will increase as the wear increases.
If the wear of a part is going to be over 90% at the end of the race, assume it will break, it's the safest option. They may break more towards the end of the race if the wear is predicted to be 92% after, but going with it is quite a risk and you only have yourself to blame if the part breaks and you lose out.
E: Limiting the amount of randoms defeats the purpose of it being random. Plus what sort of randoms is limited? Pure randoms that are out of your control? If it's that then when you reach the limit for the season, you will know 100% that you won't get any more randoms. So it just defeats the purpose of randoms.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#15 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 17:56:48
|
Quote
|
|
Randoms are randoms. Smoking (regardless of % wear) is not a real random. It does suck as if it was and, yes, I had my share of either of those. It'll steam out in a couple races.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
#16 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 18:01:28
|
Quote
|
I guess a rule 'higher % of wear = bigger chance for part beeing broken' is ok,but there need too be some limit (lets say 90%) which will be start of danger zone,but when something broke before 90% it is unexpected and I think we can call it random as much as tire puncture or something like that.
As Josh said,luck became too big part of this game...I would like to see in elite best of the best people racing not the luckiest.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#17 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 18:04:06
|
Quote
|
|
If the randoms are not randoms, what they are? Yeah, i hate to get randoms just when i need to get high position or enything, but thats why is called random...
|
|
|
|
if you use high risks no random can really be regarded as a true/pure one for the simple fact that you opted into the possibility of getting one with that choice. Also, parts don't have to smoke/break only at over 90%.
What is true I found that the more wear and more risks that are applied, the greater your chance of what everyone calls 'random'. So, if you enter a race with several or many parts on, above 50~60% for example there's a stronger likelihood of getting one if you were pummelling your parts with high risks. Every part has a breaking point after all and the more pressure you put on worn parts, the more likely they are to break.
From what I've learnt and understood the only true randoms are either those that occur on low-ish wear with low-ish risks or those that were brand new and broke immediately (and often going straight to 99%). So, Joe is correct above that you are better off taking the line of thought in assuming that a part might well break with high risk on a worn part rather than it won't...and consider that it almost definitely will break rather than it won't :) If you prepare with the latter mentality then I generally found it easier to take randoms >_<
So...I don't think a limit can be applied to randoms really while managers are executing enough options that don't necessarily make them all that 'random'.
Sorry to take you round the houses with that.
BTW, I hate them as much as anyone...i'm not defending 'randoms' and the shit luck in getting them (the pure ones), more attaching blame at all of us for being so competitive ;) It's just unfortunate that someone always has to get lucky/unlucky when everyone is chucking high risks at races (particularly from Pro and up). So, it can seem like a lottery...(sadly). But putting a limit on 'randoms' is not really something that can be implemented due to all the possibilities involved in being on the end of one.
:(
|
|
|
|
|
|
#19 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 18:11:29
|
Quote
|
Quote ( Goran Slunjski @ December 3rd 2014,17:13:21 ) So I think it would be good for a game to bring rule: Random limit per season
maybe you can impose to yourself a CT risk limit for all the season.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#20 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 18:31:26
|
Quote
|
Ok,I understand what you want to say...but answer me those 2 questions:
1) If those push (high risks) are problem for randoms ,then why all pushers don't have as mush randoms as those guy or two guys who get bunch of it in that season? they use big risks for sure too and some people get 4-5 randoms per season and some people not even one.
2) you wanna tell me that in my promo season at pro or master I shouldn't push? O.o
So,high risks are there just to look nice and I should promote in master with 50-70ct.
Or Claudio,do you think that we all can get the best drivers with which we can lower ct during season and still be in top for promotion...then everything happens in office by singing contracts and nothing on track... I repeat It is STRATEGY GAME,strategy in race should play biggest role not just sign a guy with biggest talent...we can't all get amazing drivers (or we should train them for 6-7 seasons just to have fun in one season) there is no fun in that and people will start leaving game...remember what I said. and then will be very much fun when amateur will look as rookie look right now (10-20 participants)
|
|
|
|
|
|
#21 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 18:37:10
|
Quote
|
Yeah, randoms are things that everyone hates and it will not change.. but if randoms are taken out of the game, then it just could be boring.
Like for me this season, I went full CT to get a podium finish, but in around lap 10~ I went strangely to pits because one dude blocked me so my driver went also in "Like wtf?!". So I was in last place after this with full CT?! But still I managed to climb to 5th place so it isn't that bad but still it costed so much money and it was almost pointless.
By the way, I suggest to not use high overtake risks... if you want to lower your randoms.
|
|
|
|
Quote ( Goran Slunjski @ December 3rd 2014,18:31:26 ) If those push (high risks) are problem for randoms ,then why all pushers don't have as mush randoms as those guy or two guys who get bunch of it in that season? they use big risks for sure too and some people get 4-5 randoms per season and some people not even one.
depends on the type of random though, the wear and level of the parts...some other specifics too. Maybe the guys getting less randoms had lower parts wear at more races for example and replaced them more frequently. Of course, the fact that they might also have just been more lucky is a viable reasoning too :) All i'm saying is...it's still difficult to pinpoint the whys and hows of getting randoms when you consider the possibilities :/
Quote ( Goran Slunjski @ December 3rd 2014,18:31:26 ) 2) you wanna tell me that in my promo season at pro or master I shouldn't push? O.o
So,high risks are there just to look nice and I should promote in master with 50-70ct.
I think he was just giving you an option if you didn't like randoms, rather than telling you what to do in your promo push. I.e...if you don't like it that using a high risk could possibly result in a higher chance of a random, don't use such high risk kinda thing. I get what he's saying, though not at all helpful for you or anyone unless everyone else decided to have the same mentality/approach :D
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
#23 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 18:44:36
|
Quote
|
Love the idea of a limit... best idea ever.
"Oh look, I've had my randoms, cool, no more for season".
The only way it would ever be applicable would be if the developers implemented it without announcing it... otherwise it's making public a fairly key piece of the game mechanic.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#24 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 18:56:22
|
Quote
|
Quote ( Goran Slunjski @ December 3rd 2014,18:01:28 ) I guess a rule 'higher % of wear = bigger chance for part beeing broken' is ok,but there need too be some limit (lets say 90%) which will be start of danger zone,but when something broke before 90% it is unexpected and I think we can call it random as much as tire puncture or something like that.
But that is the case though, really. Which is why parts that are over 90% are orange in your "update car" page. It is highly unlikely for parts to break beforehand really, but there is still a chance for that occurring. Currently, over 90% IS the danger zone.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#25 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 19:01:47
|
Quote
|
Quote ( Andreas Ramann @ December 3rd 2014,18:37:10 ) Yeah, randoms are things that everyone hates and it will not change.. but if randoms are taken out of the game, then it just could be boring.
Like for me this season, I went full CT to get a podium finish, but in around lap 10~ I went strangely to pits because one dude blocked me so my driver went also in "Like wtf?!". So I was in last place after this with full CT?! But still I managed to climb to 5th place so it isn't that bad but still it costed so much money and it was almost pointless.
By the way, I suggest to not use high overtake risks... if you want to lower your randoms.
in amateur is possible to get back in top even with random...try that in pro or master.
Quote ( Stuart Foster @ December 3rd 2014,18:37:30 ) Quote ( Goran Slunjski @ December 3rd 2014,18:31:26 )
If those push (high risks) are problem for randoms ,then why all pushers don't have as mush randoms as those guy or two guys who get bunch of it in that season? they use big risks for sure too and some people get 4-5 randoms per season and some people not even one.
depends on the type of random though, the wear and level of the parts...some other specifics too. Maybe the guys getting less randoms had lower parts wear at more races for example and replaced them more frequently. Of course, the fact that they might also have just been more lucky is a viable reasoning too :) All i'm saying is...it's still difficult to pinpoint the whys and hows of getting randoms when you consider the possibilities :/
Quote ( Goran Slunjski @ December 3rd 2014,18:31:26 )
2) you wanna tell me that in my promo season at pro or master I shouldn't push? O.o
So,high risks are there just to look nice and I should promote in master with 50-70ct.
I think he was just giving you an option if you didn't like randoms, rather than telling you what to do in your promo push. I.e...if you don't like it that using a high risk could possibly result in a higher chance of a random, don't use such high risk kinda thing. I get what he's saying, though not at all helpful for you or anyone unless everyone else decided to have the same mentality/approach :D
I don't use big OT and DF at all,just CT...and now see my situation: tire puncture (lost 6 points and rivals get 1 or 2 points more because of my bad luck and tire loose which give me 1 more stop and destroy my race). After losing so much points (and I couldn't do ANYTHING about it,pure randoms) I need to push hard to catch my rivals for promo spot...and what you are trying to say to me is push but don't push...sorry but I don't see that like an normal situation.
And what are those 2 randoms game is telling to me: thank you for trying hard last few season (that is almost half year!), try next year.
And that's ok to you?
|
|
|
|
Maybe its an idea to skip the randoms
What we can do is buy at the beginning of a new season a engine supplier. On the same way as the tyres.
You can buy for example 8 different engine with different prices but every engine has got another reliability. The reliability gives you the different kind of randoms.
So everyone can choose his own random or not:-)
|
|
|
|
Quote ( Goran Slunjski @ December 3rd 2014,19:01:47 ) And that's ok to you?
It is, cos it's not the most important thing in the world when all is said and done :) Life is random, makes little difference to me if GPRO is :) I think you learn to accept/deal with these things the longer you play the game. Again, I'm not saying I like this aspect of the game, but there has to be a hard luck element to it and i can neither think of a better or worse replacement to randoms than the existing hard luck system.
There really can't be a limit of randoms when there are so many possibilities involved in one and also a random isn't random anymore if there was a limit of 2/3 and you reached your limit...cos you know there is 0% chance of getting one until R1 of the next season. That itself ends up making it no longer random, but fixed odds.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#28 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 19:51:53
|
Quote
|
You can't compare this game with life...in life hard work always find a way to catch a prize which deserve,just need to trying more and more... this game just opposite,more you trying more they will f**k you in mind.
That's why elite will go just weaker and weaker and at some point game will lose al the best players (already started)...and everyone who say that game is just fine in the way it's now is a person who don't believe in himself that he is better player than others and that one day could become champion.
I understand that is hard to change that.
For example,it's same as FIFA punishing their referee for some big mistake... they won't ,because that will prove that FIFA was wrong,and they are "never wrong". If you understand what I want to say.
|
|
|
|
|
|
#29 geplaatst Dec 3 2014, 20:02:38
|
Quote
|
Quote ( Rogerio Pereira @ December 3rd 2014,17:56:48 ) Randoms are randoms. Smoking (regardless of % wear) is not a real random. It does suck as if it was and, yes, I had my share of either of those. It'll steam out in a couple races.
I disagree...
smoking is a random. A true random... What can you do to prevent your vehicle parts from smoking when wear has not reached 90+? start every race with a new part? Use 0 CT? lol.
|
|
|
|
Quote ( Goran Slunjski @ December 3rd 2014,19:51:53 ) . this game just opposite,more you trying more they will f**k you in mind.
but it doesn't aim to f**k anyone in the mind anymore than it should anyone else since while randoms don't target players, they are just...bad luck. So, it then comes down to which players have the mentality to handle them better. BTW, at this point I'd like to point a post that Roland made in the elite thread earlier this season (I think it was this season at least)...it's worth a read...I'l try and find it....
Of course, maybe its bad that a game not only depends on the skill of the management but also a players mindset..it technically adds another strategy aspect. Though I agree with you that it has potential to drain the game of its better players, sadly.
One thing else...
I take a view that there's no better system to replace randoms than the system already in place UNLESS they were removed completely. HOWEVER...if we consider that the game has to have a hard luck element that allows for the possibility of another player with a weaker package or strategy to finish ahead of a (considered to be) stronger opponent in a race, what in your view would be a better replacement for what we already have so that a season is not determined purely by who is better prepared and have races going round in a procession where we know the result pretty much before it started barring any management mistake?
Make qualifying push risk more random perhaps? Is that better than a random (for some maybe, but imagine how frustrating it'd be with risk being high of a bad qualifying in every race?) Surely you'd rather live with what we have?
The game either must have randoms or not have them at all I think....and in the event it does not have them, there needs to still be the possibility of bad luck..so how could that still be retained without causing the current frustration with them and still allowing players with a weaker package in a race to prosper???
|
|
English
Deutsch
Español
Română
Italiano
Português
Português
Français
Polski
Русский
Български
Македонски
Српски
Nederlands
Suomi
Lietuvių
Čeština
Magyar
Eesti keel
Slovenčina
Türkçe
Shqip
Ελληνικά
Hrvatski
Bahasa Melayu
Dansk
Pirate
