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Themenumfrage
Do you agree with this suggestion
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Thema: Broken parts must be changed |
59 Antworten
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#31 geschrieben Okt 4 2018, 16:49:05
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Quote ( Jean Chapados @ October 4th 2018,16:07:09 ) First, thanks all for your comments. I will not quote all of you individually but I will explain more my thoughts.
100% wear doesn't mean the part it broken. therefore you can start with 100% wear.
People with -300 000 000 will be -300 000 000 whatever the system.
During a full season not many parts should break if you plan and manage correctly. The main purpose here is to force manager to plan on 17 races instead of 14 and change the obvious strategy of not spending any money at the end of season.
1. So what is your definition of a broken part then. Wear is the only thing that you have to determine how capable a part is before a race. There is no such thing as a "broken part" specifically.
2. I assume the huge debt point you make is with regard to my questions about how to handle people who can't afford to replace their parts. It seems rather flippant, if so. Are we trying to scare away newer players who may not have a grasp of how the game works yet? Or what about someone who just makes a mistake and "updates car" while forgetting to replace a part?
You can't just dismiss the questions on it. How would such things work if someone can not afford to replace a part? And can't downgrade? Are you stopping them starting a race altogether?
The specifics and implications of the suggestion must be considered.
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#32 geschrieben Okt 4 2018, 16:54:40
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Quote ( Tibor Szuromi @ October 4th 2018,16:27:55 ) I have a bad idea. Maybe it's good.
Do not get the new car free for the new season. Pay for it. In proportion to wear. (Everybody. Exception - Rookie.)
I don't think your idea is so bad :)
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Quote ( Kevin Parkinson @ October 4th 2018,16:49:05 ) The specifics and implications of the suggestion must be considered.
It's a compromise.
1. Do not get the new car free for the new season. Pay for it. In proportion to wear. (Everybody. Exception - Rookie.)
or
2. 100% wear (part). Next season: -1 level and 0 wear.
Quote ( Dusan Sevarlic @ October 4th 2018,16:54:40 ) I don't think your idea is so bad :) Tx.
Finance must be handled to the Staff (modification).
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#34 geschrieben Okt 4 2018, 16:56:15
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Think its a quite good idea but not as its redacted....lots of things that must be considered in many departments,also definitions of whats a broken part and at what stage and with how much wear it should be repaired.Lots of good things can come up with this idea,but it needs a lot of work and discussion and reach a sort of concensus.Hope that will be possible,but honestly cant see that happening....
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Quote ( Tibor Szuromi @ October 4th 2018,16:55:36 ) It's a compromise
Thanks, Timor, but wasn't asking about your suggestion lol :)
I am all for smoking cars being easier to pass, especially those starting on very high wear.
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Quote ( Kevin Parkinson @ October 4th 2018,16:58:45 ) Timor,
"Timor" doesn't mean anything in Hungarian :)
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#37 geschrieben Okt 4 2018, 17:20:27
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My suggestion supplements "smoking" and partly sanctions it. :)
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#38 geschrieben Okt 4 2018, 17:38:02
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I think the developers tried to handle the high wear details via the quite reduced performance via car wear, but Mikko's additional penalty for +90% worn parts sounds right. I'd maybe increase the threshold to 95% or so, tho, because there are parts that can produce <10% wear even at CT 100 in some tracks.
The effect of people who are deliberately smoking but for some reason go Force to the front, topped by boosted qualys because of going xsoft and low Q2 fuel, is too intrusive for the race outcome. There is no need for 20 laps blocking. Last race, for instance, 25-30 cars were +20s down the leader in Elite and Master after just 10 laps. Recovering a +10s gap in the remaining of the race is complicated, and if the manager achieves so, it also means he could have gotten a way better result hadn't it been by that early blocking, which was worthless for the blocker anyways.
Also, my own advice, for what it's worth. Smoking races on purpose is rarely an actual good move package wise. In the last +200 races I can recall only of 2 smoked on purpose races. One was one of the rare cases in which smoking saved some cash, because it was a season where Indy oval was at R2 and the car wear was too much for 2 testings and R1 + R2 wear, but replacing the full engine after just 1 race was bad business as well. The other time was due to driver motivation control for a renewal. In general, tho, you need to be consistent, and consistency can't be achieved by the perceived savings produced by smoking races.
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#39 geschrieben Okt 4 2018, 18:47:52
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Quote ( Mike Bennett @ October 4th 2018,15:09:24 ) Chris you are not getting the most use out of your parts if they don't reach 100%, in the last race I had 6 parts all @ 100%. Kyle has the whole car on 100% :)
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Quote ( Dominik Karda @ October 4th 2018,18:47:52 ) Quote ( Mike Bennett @ October 4th 2018,15:09:24 )
Chris you are not getting the most use out of your parts if they don't reach 100%, in the last race I had 6 parts all @ 100%.
Kyle has the whole car on 100% :)
Page [1]
Just think about your facilities... Sometimes, you will not smoke, even if your car parts are on 100% :)
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#41 geschrieben Okt 4 2018, 19:58:55
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Quote ( Mikko Heikkinen @ October 4th 2018,16:08:13 ) But hey... I think something can be extracted from that...
The parts wear effect in qualifying could be enhanced. In other words, the more wear on parts, the less likely to get a good time on qualify lap.
That could also have a positive effect to the phenomenon I described in post #15
Because their starting position would be closer to their real potential race result, there would be less disturbance for the ones who are racing for real.
I really agree with your opinion and the whole problem it makes. Personally I dont like when very worn car slow down a lot of managers even though they finnish ahaed a few laps as you mentioned.
So to pace down these very worn cars in Q could have a really good impact for managers that sometimes rely on smoking almost half of the season.
Then you should decide if it worth for you to give up last few races of the season
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#42 geschrieben Okt 4 2018, 20:06:51
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Quote ( Mike Bennett @ October 4th 2018,15:09:24 ) Chris you are not getting the most use out of your parts if they don't reach 100%, in the last race I had 6 parts all @ 100%.
I agree with Mike, you have to save money https://postimg.cc/4mMnW6g4
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#43 geschrieben Okt 4 2018, 20:37:15
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Quote ( Dominik Karda @ October 4th 2018,20:37:15 ) Those level 9 parts, lol
I am a millionaire, American cars are great haha
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#45 geschrieben Okt 4 2018, 22:08:52
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Quote ( Ľubomír Štec @ October 4th 2018,19:58:55 ) Quote ( Mikko Heikkinen @ October 4th 2018,16:08:13 )
But hey... I think something can be extracted from that...
The parts wear effect in qualifying could be enhanced. In other words, the more wear on parts, the less likely to get a good time on qualify lap.
That could also have a positive effect to the phenomenon I described in post #15
Because their starting position would be closer to their real potential race result, there would be less disturbance for the ones who are racing for real.
I really agree with your opinion and the whole problem it makes. Personally I dont like when very worn car slow down a lot of managers even though they finnish ahaed a few laps as you mentioned.
So to pace down these very worn cars in Q could have a really good impact for managers that sometimes rely on smoking almost half of the season.
Then you should decide if it worth for you to give up last few races of the season
i agree with this idea. very worn car can't be quick in qualify...
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#46 geschrieben Okt 5 2018, 00:22:30
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I think this a really good conversation to have. Lots of the small changes to the game have been really positive but one thing that's always slightly annoyed me is that tanking for long periods of time is so easy and rewarding. I think we should be encouraging people to race more.
Energy is a great example of a good change overall because before everyone was just either running really high or really low risks before and now you need to put more thought into it. But it's also made smoking even more attractive because you can more easily stay in the 90% distance since the front runners don't run away from you as much as they are not permanently on max risks.
The qualifying change would at least stop smokers interfering with people who are actually racing but I still think a couple of further steps to make smoking riskier would be good.
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that´s absolutely right, it just make racing managers better position and clear way of smokers in the beginning of the race.
But still there is need to change smoking at all. Not sure what would be beneficial but make it less profitable because now you can easily rely on one smoked race (let´s say in the middle of the season) where you know you will complete 90% rule (but still I get it, it is a part of managerial) but to change behavior of people that are able to smoke even the half of the season just to save money (even I dont understand why).
Change in qually would be fine, but still that has to be modified in race as well :/
E:
And also got an idea: You cannot push hard on the start when you have such a worn car, easy just to not allow driver to put any risk on the start ;)
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#48 geschrieben Okt 5 2018, 08:29:43
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I cannot see us getting further into the racing if we have parts reaching critical wear so fast.. Seems like one would have to be playing 10 years or more to get into the top lot now.. or they favour certain countries.
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#49 geschrieben Okt 5 2018, 08:35:08
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Quote ( Lee Ifans @ October 5th 2018,00:22:30 ) I think we should be encouraging people to race more. In what way?
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I just think that if used part will be affect performance.
Just like;
0% to 49% will not decrease the performance
50% to 74% will decrease 5% performance
75% to 89% will decrease 10% performance
90% to 99% will decrease 25% performance
100% the part is already at broken state
Well, i dont know. Just my opinion. Thanks
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#51 geschrieben Okt 5 2018, 09:23:25
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Make it really interesting - incremental performance loss in line with all parts wear. It would change the game hugely but create a really interesting management decision making dynamic.
In relation to the proposed change, I can see an argument for forcing upgrades, but only for 100% worn parts. The financial aspect could be addressed by making level 1 parts free.
I also completely agree that 100% wear (if it is to be allowed) should result in smoking right from the start and an immediate loss of performance / ability to affect race results.
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#52 geschrieben Okt 5 2018, 10:18:50
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Quote ( Mikko Heikkinen @ October 4th 2018,16:38:00 ) Quote ( Lee Ifans @ October 4th 2018,16:16:02 )
But you're right, harsher pace penalties for worn cars in qualifying would be good
I really think I'm onto something there. So...
Maybe it wouldn't even have to be such a major change to the current, depending on how much work it would be to add a curve to it.
For example: If any part has >=90% wear in qualify, the potential pace wold decrease significantly
probably no need change to 0-89%
(90% is already a limit value and goes to "orange")
figures for example purposes only
2 place grid penalty for any part 95-98% wear
3 place penalty for any part 99%+
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#53 geschrieben Okt 5 2018, 10:35:43
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Quote ( Rahmat Febrizal @ October 5th 2018,08:46:47 ) I just think that if used part will be affect performance.
Just like;
0% to 49% will not decrease the performance
50% to 74% will decrease 5% performance
75% to 89% will decrease 10% performance
90% to 99% will decrease 25% performance
100% the part is already at broken state
Well, i don't know. Just my opinion. Thanks
That is already how it works, although few know how much the parts are affected by wear.
But a car with very high wear is slower than the same car with low wear, as far as Im aware.
Try it out for yourself, by doing some practice laps before you change the worn parts and then a few more after you change it to a new part, with the same level.
You will see a difference in performance, between the worn and new parts.
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#54 geschrieben Okt 5 2018, 10:41:47
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This is an interesting discussion...
I do agree that 100% parts should be forced to replace, with a few exceptions/variants:
1) if you have positive balance:
a) If any part is at 100% and is is not end of the season, do not allow to qualify/race until the part is downgraded to less worn one (if part_level > 1) or a new one.
b) If part is level 1 and it reached 100% wear, do not allow to qualify/race until new part is installed.
c) If it is the end of the season, and the part wear reaches 100%, replace that part with a new one for next season at half the price of the part at that level. Other parts get replaced for free.
2) if you have negative balance:
a) If any part is 100% and the race is not the last race of the season, do not allow to qualify/race until the part is downgraded to a less worn one (if part_level > 1).
b) If part is level 1 and it reached 100% wear, but you still have negative balance, you are allowed to qualify/race, but your performance in qualy will be decreased a lot and in the race you will smoke from the start. (NOTE: Maybe even forced risk of 0)
c) If it is the end of the season, and part wear reaches 100%, replace that part with a new one, but of 1 level less, for free (applies to Pro groups and above, of course). All other parts are also replaced for free. (NOTE: I added the "1 level less" at the last minute.)
3) other points:
a) I kinda liked the idea of level 1 parts being free, but I think this would just break the game from Rookies above...
b) I was debating between repairing the part at the end of season for half-price or replacing the part with 1 level lower part (if balance is positive). Both ideas seem interesting, but I think half-price repairs would be a bit more challenging (especially for managers who sometimes suck with finances, like me lol).
c) I was thinking and also had an idea that if you're downgrading you could downgrade to level 1 part which would be at 0%, but this fell short because proper usage for this would be only if part is lvl5 or higher, and at any other levels it would just break the game, IMO.
Just a few thoughts.
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#55 geschrieben Okt 5 2018, 10:50:48
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Quote ( Mantas Jokubauskas @ October 5th 2018,10:41:47 ) This is an interesting discussion... Interesting.
Is not it complicated to program?
Many rules. Is not it difficult to follow?
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Forced replace or downgrade? Really?
One season last about 1,5 month. And if something goes wrong, and you will lose all new sponsors, driver and tires become expensive, what manager should do? All your suggestions are to kill him, bring him down for many more seasons, cause even if he will have a 1 million he should go negative or downgrade car. He will never upgrade his position, he will still lose all negotiations, performance still will be awful and he will be drowning deeper and deeper. And he will quit the game because he will lose many more month of his real life. And only one season of smoking will give him the advantage to get back into the game in the next season.
If I have 5 seasons of completely messing, except one, I will probably quit the game.
I had a couple of worth seasons. In one I picked Conties and season was cold, and all my sponsors were gone. In Additional I had 3 punctures and start incidence in a row with completely new parts. And I had a second bad season after only one season in Elite. No money, unable to get a good driver, and low performance in every race made it even worth.
Just a reminder: low performance in a race and in Q - unable to sign up a new sponsor.
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#57 geschrieben Okt 5 2018, 22:03:58
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loool maybe you should focus more on better parts of the game :P
Quote ( Andriy Dyadkovich @ October 5th 2018,11:42:00 ) low performance in a race and in Q - unable to sign up a new sponsor.
I dont agree at all.
I would like to have change in Q pace according to very worn car and make these smoking cars not slowing you down in the first few laps.
I also dont like forced replace or downgrade...that would not fit the game much more :/ sometimes you just need to go with one, two worn parts to make better management ;)
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#58 geschrieben Okt 6 2018, 01:03:37
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Quote ( Jean Chapados @ October 4th 2018,14:58:46 ) Sorry if it has already been proposed but I can't find anything about this in the forum.
I know this game is not real life, but to make it more logic (...)
The computer sez no.
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#59 geschrieben Okt 7 2018, 15:48:13
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Quote ( Mikko Heikkinen @ October 4th 2018,16:08:13 ) The parts wear effect in qualifying could be enhanced. In other words, the more wear on parts, the less likely to get a good time on qualify lap.
Quote ( Mikko Heikkinen @ October 4th 2018,16:38:00 ) For example: If any part has >=90% wear in qualify, the potential pace wold decrease significantly
probably no need change to 0-89%
(90% is already a limit value and goes to "orange")
Great suggestion but why restrict it only to qualifying? Make it a general rule that affect performance in every session.
Quote ( Edwin Silva @ October 4th 2018,17:38:02 ) [i}I'd maybe increase the threshold to 95% or so, tho, because there are parts that can produce <10% wear even at CT 100 in some tracks.
I see no advantage to make the range so limited, on the contrary...
Quote ( Rahmat Febrizal @ October 5th 2018,08:46:47 ) I just think that if used part will be affect performance.
0% to 49% will not decrease the performance
50% to 74% will decrease 5% performance
75% to 89% will decrease 10% performance
90% to 99% will decrease 25% performance
100% the part is already at broken state
Something exponential would fit great here.
Quote ( Simon Allen @ October 5th 2018,09:23:25 ) Make it really interesting - incremental performance loss in line with all parts wear. It would change the game hugely but create a really interesting management decision making dynamic.
Totally agree!
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#60 geschrieben Okt 7 2018, 18:22:54
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I won't delve into to much here.
But its very clear a lot of you have loads to learn in regards to parts and pace etc.
The only thing I can support here is that if any managers part is 100% during qualifying or at the start of the race then the car smokes during qualifying and for the duration of the whole race. I'd even argue mutliple 100% parts. They do not make it off the line. Stationary basically from lap 1.
All the other talk is somewhat already part of the game. The reliance of staff/facilities could maybe play a bigger part of a cars reliability but clearly a lot of you don't even see this currently.
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