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Topic: 90% rule (again) |
704 replies
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Leader overlapped you by 2 laps. When you look at race summary, you actually completed 53 laps :(
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Quote ( Jukka Sireni @ March 30th 2018,22:56:29 ) /gb/RaceSummary.asp?group=Pro+-+2&Season=63&Race=17
Wow Jukka, that explains a lot. But I don’t understand why It didn’t show that on the live race screen or on my race analysis page. Both are showing me that my driver completed 55 laps!?
How come?
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Quote ( Ahmet Sonverdi @ March 30th 2018,22:57:06 ) Leader overlapped you by 2 laps. When you look at race summary, you actually completed 53 laps :(
I get the Overlapping but it shows me as completing 55 laps.
55 laps competed is what I did even though I was 2 laps behind the leader.
He was on lap 57 when I dropped out which means I had already covered 55 laps.
I don’t understand why 2 laps are being substracted from my total. Did my driver do 2 laps in reverse?
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It's simple Kevin: it is where you are in the race when the leader crosses the line, not how far you manage to get after that.
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Quote ( Jody Parker @ March 30th 2018,23:06:06 ) It's simple Kevin: it is where you are in the race when the leader crosses the line, not how far you manage to get after that.
Like I said, leader was on lap 57, I completed lap 55, and after crossing the finish line I dropped out. Race analysis and live race screen show me as completing 55 laps (at the 57 lap marker on the live race screen). The race wasn’t over yet, winner wasn’t yet decided when my 55 laps were completed and I dropped out. Simple isn’t it!? Have a look at my race and see for yourself.
I think the substraction of 2 laps off my total is a possible bug.
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The rules state
90% race distance rule: If you don't cover 90% of the race distance (as determined in the race summary) you will receive only 50% of the race income according to the table above. The relevant bit is in the brackets
The difference between analysis and summary is annoying, but it is the summary that determines the calculation.
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On the old race screen, the leader did 56 laps and it shows you in the pit lane 3 laps down showing you only did 53 laps
The live screen does appear to be off with the laps, but yeah you did 53 laps
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Like I have said, the laps completed rule is quite strange, and the new viewer makes it even more strange.
What happens is that you get 2x lap time from laps you didn't complete, and then the amount of lap times you are behind in the end decides how many laps you are behind. This basically equals the laps you didn't cover based on race analysis + the laps you were behind at the moment of retirement.
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Quote ( Graham Mercer @ March 30th 2018,23:15:27 ) The rules state
90% race distance rule: If you don't cover 90% of the race distance (as determined in the race summary) you will receive only 50% of the race income according to the table above. The relevant bit is in the brackets
The difference between analysis and summary is annoying, but it is the summary that determines the calculation.
Thanks Graham.
Yes, annoying is an understatement.
What’s the point of watching the live race screen if it is irrelevant and the race analysis data we pay for as supporters is erroneous?
Hear me out 1 last time and keep an open mind that there may be a bug.
I believe there is an error in the race summary script. Because 2 sets of data shows 55 laps completed while taking in to consideration my 2 laps down at that time in the race. While the summary is removing another 2 laps which would mean that I should have been 4 laps down when I dropped out on lap 53 which is impossible!?
How can that be explained? I believe I was in 14th at the time (my lap 55, the leaders lap 57). There is no way I was 4 laps behind the leader on my lap 53 which would have been his lap 57. This needs to be explained or I believe there may be a possible bug.
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Every other explanation you have all given me up until I understand and makes sense.
But me being 4 laps down on lap 53 needs to be show to me.
I just thought of something, Lets go have a look on the old viewer.
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Kevin take a look at the replay in the old race viewer. As Kyle mentions that shows you dropping out when the leader is on lap 56 and you are 3 laps behind on lap 53.
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Quote ( Jukka Sireni @ March 30th 2018,23:27:40 ) Like I have said, the laps completed rule is quite strange, and the new viewer makes it even more strange.
What happens is that you get 2x lap time from laps you didn't complete, and then the amount of lap times you are behind in the end decides how many laps you are behind. This basically equals the laps you didn't cover based on race analysis + the laps you were behind at the moment of retirement.
Very confusing and unconventional Jukka. How can this be fixed to show the real “old race screen “ data? This has been such a buzz kill for me. I needed the income and really was hoping to complete 90%. I watched the race live, celebrated after completing 54 laps and then get a rod bender when I see my race income at only 50%! Now I risk getting blue balls!
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Quote ( Jukka Sireni @ March 30th 2018,23:27:40 ) What happens is that you get 2x lap time from laps you didn't complete, and then the amount of lap times you are behind in the end decides how many laps you are behind. This basically equals the laps you didn't cover based on race analysis + the laps you were behind at the moment of retirement.
Imagine explaining all this to new players to the game lol :/ Need a better system, surely :/
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Agree Kevin. :(
I love the live race viewer and think that it is an incredible achievement, but this aspect of it is indeed very frustrating and confusing.
You would think that there must be some way to get the analysis, summary, new viewer and old viewer to be consistent in the data they present?
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Well, it has been the same since the beginning for 853967 managers. The new viewer obviously makes it even more confusing, but there has been the same disparity between race analysis and summary always. And even in the old viewer, even though it shows -2 laps after lap 55, it still shows your lap time for lap 55.
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Just a stupid thought here !
Like the real thing,, IE Vettel with the "dodgy pit stop" in first race...
It should be same here ?? If peeps are laps behind,, so what,, they can pit and would still be behind ,, unless you get a little lucky !
But I imagine that's not easy to program ?
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Quote ( Graham Mercer @ March 30th 2018,23:47:28 ) Agree Kevin. :(
You would think that there must be some way to get the analysis, summary, new viewer and old viewer to be consistent in the data they present?
This is hopefully the next step Graham. Maybe this thread will help speed up this process. Fingers crossed.
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As far as I understand it, the system is only like it is so that players have 100% and "clean" data whether they complete all laps or are 5 laps down on a leader....would be unfair that lapped cars have gaps in their data at the end of the race compared to players who complete all laps. I don't see an easy solution tbh, I mean it can probably fixed easily, but not without upsetting the harvested data for lapped cars...and that would upset a lot of people I guess, and with reason if you're a paying supporter.
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Comparing Kevin's (Pro-2) data presented in the old vs new race viewers shows the following:
Old viewer
Lap 55
position 17th
time 1:31.818
gap to 16 6.402s
gap to leader 3:25.713s
Leader lap time 1:26.603s
Lap 56
Out of race
New viewer
lap 57 (at the point when Kevin crosses the line)
position 17th
time 1:31.817 (rounding?)
gap to 16th 16 6.402s
gap to leader 3:25.713s
Leader lap time 1:25.678
Lap 58
Out of race
So the viewers present the same lap data but label it as different lap numbers, which is confusing. The lap number in each viewer is relative to the leader, but shows different lap times for the leader on that lap.
I assume that both viewers are getting the same data from the race engine, so surely the information can be displayed consistently? At least between the two viewers, even if they are different to the race summary?
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Quote ( Graham Mercer @ March 31st 2018,01:32:08 ) Comparing Kevin's (Pro-2) data presented in the old vs new race viewers shows the following
Keep in mind that I am 2 laps behind the leader at this point.
90% is 54 laps.
So in this situation the difference between a lap 53 and a lap 55 drop out is almost $5 million dollars in race income.
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Quote ( Kevin Fortin @ March 30th 2018,22:54:31 ) Hello,
Could an admin please have a look at my race 17 income.
The last race was 60 laps *0.9= 54 laps needed to be completed in order to earn full income. I completed 55 laps before dropping out but I only received 50% of my race income.
Please let me know if this is a bug or what I am missing here because right now I don’t understand why I am only receiving 50%?
Thanks!
you only completed 53 laps
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Quote ( Kevin Fortin @ March 31st 2018,02:17:43 ) Quote ( Graham Mercer @ March 31st 2018,01:32:08 )
Comparing Kevin's (Pro-2) data presented in the old vs new race viewers shows the following
Keep in mind that I am 2 laps behind the leader at this point.
90% is 54 laps.
So in this situation the difference between a lap 53 and a lap 55 drop out is almost $5 million dollars in race income.
My last post is more about the inconsistency between the two viewers at this point.
At least have them display consistently.
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Quote ( Shane Larsen @ March 31st 2018,02:27:39 you only completed 53 laps
You obviously didn't read any other posts before commenting.
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Quote ( Kevin Fortin @ March 31st 2018,02:32:26 ) Quote ( Shane Larsen @ March 31st 2018,02:27:39
you only completed 53 laps
You obviously didn't read any other posts before commenting.
maybe because i didn't see there was another page, after i clicked on the forum post in the home page, it took me to page 18, instead of the latest comment
my bad
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So completing 55 laps but dropping out incurs a penalty of 2x the worst lap time, or 2 less laps counted as run.
Is how I understand it then.
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So it seems to me that instead of timing the race to the lead car, the algorithms treat all cars in the race as if they're doing X amount of laps by themselves; and any car that fails to match the lap count are stuck on which lap they're completing at the moment.
So I'll assume if the race leader has completed lap 40 of 44 and is now on lap 41 of 44, at which point my car is registered out of the race on lap 40 just one lap down, I'll only have completed just over 88% of race distance.
Or what about this? It's the same race length, but my pace is so slow that I shouldn't have been allowed to start the race to begin with; I get lapped 5 times but finish the race having completed 48 laps of 53. That is good for just eking out 90.5% race distance.
Am I to assume that by my car sitll operational on lap 52 of 53, yet get lapped on the 53rd lap, to no longer be within the 90% threshold? Remember, in the above scenario on the leader's 52nd lap, I am still 5 laps down but this time instead of finishing 5 agonizing laps down, somewhere on that final lap get lapped a 6th time. Would I be classified as having completed the race or would a be subject to the penalty for not completing 90% race distance? I'm sure nobody here past, present, nor future will actually go on to actually pull this off... I hope. But it is an intriguing point to ponder.
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- I thing its necessary another step on this rule.
...80% rule of the race Laps to 75% of the Position Money.!!!
so >=90% ..............100%
....>=80% & <90% ...75%
....<80% ..................50%
Thanks.-
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The race screens are just a visual way of showing time. It's all to make the game more pretty and at one time it was all vlad did to when adding new features. The 90% rule is based on time and not how many laps the viewer says you have done.
The viewer at any given time is always based on where the leader is on the track so when it displayed lap 55 it was the leader that was on lap 55 and you were on lap 53 as you were 2 laps behind the leader.
Just look at it as you have been given 2 extra laps worth of data.
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Quote ( David Jones-Winkley @ March 31st 2018,09:20:23 ) The race screens are just a visual way of showing time. It's all to make the game more pretty and at one time it was all vlad did to when adding new features. The 90% rule is based on time and not how many laps the viewer says you have done.
Sorry but the rules say
Note that the 90% race distance is calculated on the total number of laps for a race and then rounded down to a whole lap number.
So according to the rules the 90% rule IS based on how many laps and not on time.
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- Graham have absolutely Right David.-
:)
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