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Topic: A Historical Question (Not GPRO Related) |
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#61 posted Jun 11th 2020, 17:52:39 (last edited Jun 11th 2020, 17:53:15 by Nate Lung)
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Have there been previous "challenges" like this? And if so, do you have answers from them?
This is GPRO after all, and if there's one thing it taught me... it's "look at previous data to get clues about what comes next."
I'm not saying there's a pattern in the answers... but more like "Last time there was something English, and the time before that French" and thus I would conclude to NOT look at those two countries since they'd probably do something different.
Just a thought, and all that is based on this being part of a series of riddles that have been given over time, which I'm not even sure if that's the case?
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#62 posted Jun 11th 2020, 18:04:37
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Quote ( Ahmet Sonverdi @ June 10th 2020,16:54:10 ) Quote ( Niels Van Heijster @ June 10th 2020,16:46:22 )
First: where did you find/get this from?
It's from a Turkish mobile application :)
Which application is this because there are some of them that I know like this :) Just asking to steal your prize ;)
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I'm thinking that the flower is a Lilly or even the thing itself. "Fleur de Lis" (flower of lilly), I think some French relative/guardian/ruler could die from gluttony, the flower/thing is connected to a sort of symbolic objects worthy to keep.
Now, I'm not getting into that long soap opera of generations and generations of emperors/rulers and family. But, it looks my best chance. Came to power by murder? You're not making it easy. Hopefully was by nature.
Edit: It's related to other kingdoms/empires too. This flower/thing has been all around from time to time
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#64 posted Jun 11th 2020, 18:49:13
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Quote ( Ahmet Sonverdi @ June 10th 2020,16:19:31 ) Came to force either after a nature event or after a murder
This may also mean it's an unsolved death case. How many. Before Sherlock?! But only if "nature event" should be translated to "natural cause".
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At the moment I'm thinking about the Mausoleum at Halicarnassus.
There are some clues that I haven't verified yet (cause I can't find them >.< ) but the Mausoleum was named after Mausolus (ruler of Caria, who had succeeded his father Hecatomnus) who had planned for himself this elaborate tomb. When he died the project was continued by his siblings, firstly by his sister and wife Artemisia II of Caria, who reigned for two years after his husband death. She was a a naval strategist, commander and the plant genus Artemisia was named after her according to Pliny. She is said to have mixed the ashes of his husband in her daily drink, and to have gradually pined away during the two years that she survived him (don't know if it counts as poison herself, but maybe yes).
Mausoleum at Halicarnassus was then declared one of the Seven Wonders of the Ancient World. (Does it count as a name change?)
The clues I haven't verified/found yet are "Came to force either after a nature event or after a murder", "One of his relatives who was also a ruler/emperor, died from gluttony" and "The guy who committed the suicide, has been found innocent from all charges against him". However for the last clue there is to say that The island republic of Rhodes objected to the fact that a woman was ruling Caria and fight against Artemisia for the throne of Caria.
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Quote ( Ahmet Sonverdi @ June 10th 2020,16:19:31 ) Came to force either after a nature event or after a murder (...)
***His father was also a ruler/emperor
Didn't read everything above but, he is suspect of murdering his own father, right?
Or stroke by a lightning. I mean, it could have been Zeus too.
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#67 posted Jun 11th 2020, 19:33:19
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I'm pretty much thinking about Tokugawa Ieyasu. But japanese history is soooooo difficult...
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#68 posted Jun 11th 2020, 19:35:15
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Quote ( Ferenc Lutter @ June 11th 2020,19:33:19 ) I'm pretty much thinking about Tokugawa Ieyasu. But japanese history is soooooo difficult...
His father wasn't a ruler/emperor :)
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#69 posted Jun 11th 2020, 19:37:45
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I'm helping one of my close friends to sort out his final assignment now, haven't had a proper look today.
Quote ( Zé Pedro Paula @ June 11th 2020,19:32:11 ) Didn't read everything above but, he is suspect of murdering his own father, right?
If the father was murdered, the murderer can be anyone.
Quote ( Zé Pedro Paula @ June 11th 2020,18:49:13 ) This may also mean it's an unsolved death case. How many. Before Sherlock?! But only if "nature event" should be translated to "natural cause".
It says nature event. 'Cause' has a different meaning than what was said in the clue.
Quote ( Nate Lung @ June 11th 2020,17:52:39 ) Have there been previous "challenges" like this? And if so, do you have answers from them?
Yes, there are previous ones and once someone finds the answer, everyone will know what was it.
I'll have a look at the previous questions & answers when I can.
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Quote ( Ahmet Sonverdi @ June 11th 2020,19:37:45 ) It says nature event. 'Cause' has a different meaning than what was said in the clue.
Got it. Has to be one of the two choices then. Still a suspect.
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#71 posted Jun 11th 2020, 20:02:21
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Quote ( Zé Pedro Paula @ June 11th 2020,19:46:13 ) Has to be one of the two choices then.
What are they?
I was thinking it's a Chinese emperor. Been going through the dynasties, but cant seem to find one as of yet.
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#72 posted Jun 11th 2020, 20:04:23
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Quote ( Ahmet Sonverdi @ June 10th 2020,16:19:31 ) A flower was added to that 'thing' BEFORE its name got changed
Do we know if the fact of adding that flower is the cause of the name's change ?
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#73 posted Jun 11th 2020, 20:13:41
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We don't know what caused the name change.
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Quote ( Jun Ho @ June 11th 2020,20:02:21 ) What are they?
Nature Event or Murder. And none other. The cause of coming to force. I mean I'm not English but I'm reading "come to power".
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#75 posted Jun 11th 2020, 20:55:22
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Quote ( Zé Pedro Paula @ June 11th 2020,20:17:00 ) Nature Event or Murder. And none other. The cause of coming to force. I mean I'm not English but I'm reading "come to power".
Sorry, I thought you meant you had two options for the answer :D
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#76 posted Jun 11th 2020, 20:56:12
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Quote ( Patrick Paarhuis @ June 10th 2020,19:47:22 ) i suspected it has something to do with germanicus, the ruler/emperor dying of Glutony was as far as i know Claudius, his full name was Tiberius Claudius Caesar Augustus germanicus, later there are several flowers named with the name germanicus (Iris germanicus, Caenorhinus germanicus or Mispulus germanicus)...... thats my thought on this question
Can be close too.
"Agrippina and her sons with their adherents and those of Germanicus were principal of the present emperor's animosity and dislike This family being high in the of the people he fancied that the young men might not be disposed to defer the completion their hopes until a natural event had bestowed a succession which a daring attempt might accelerate Nero and Drusus the two elder sons of this family having without any authority from the emperor been included by the senate in the forms of public prayer their names were again expunged by his order and with an admonition to the senate not to inflame the ambition of youth with premature and exorbitant honours"
From here:
https://books.google.nl/books?id=jHd9AbSsD0AC&pg=PA454&a...
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#77 posted Jun 11th 2020, 23:00:01
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Hmmm, interesting question. The closest I got is Ming - Qing transition also known as the Manchu (Mongols) conquest of China. They were also called "red-tasseled Manchus (Mongols)" with the flower ornaments on their hats. So probably the answer is "Mongolia"?
But unfortunately I could not find any Ming or Manchu emperors that died from gluttony. :(
From Wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chongzhen_Emperor
Zhu Youjian was son of the Taichang Emperor and younger brother of the Tianqi Emperor, whom he succeeded to the throne in 1627. He battled peasant rebellions and was not able to defend the northern frontier against the Manchu. When rebels reached the capital Beijing in 1644, he committed suicide, ending the Ming dynasty.
The Manchu formed the succeeding Qing dynasty.
The Manchu are an ethnic minority in China and the people from whom Manchuria derives its name. They are sometimes called "red-tasseled Manchus", a reference to the ornamentation on traditional Manchu hats. The Later Jin (1616–1636), and Qing dynasty (1636–1912) were established and ruled by Manchus, who are descended from the Jurchen people who earlier established the Jin dynasty (1115–1234) in China.
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#78 posted Jun 11th 2020, 23:13:06
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Quote ( Maxim Kotov @ June 11th 2020,23:00:01 ) Hmmm, interesting question. The closest I got is Ming - Qing transition also known as the Manchu (Mongols) conquest of China. They were also called "red-tasseled Manchus (Mongols)" with the flower ornaments on their hats. So probably the answer is "Mongolia"?
But unfortunately I could not find any Ming or Manchu emperors that died from gluttony. :(
From Wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chongzhen_Emperor
Zhu Youjian was son of the Taichang Emperor and younger brother of the Tianqi Emperor, whom he succeeded to the throne in 1627. He battled peasant rebellions and was not able to defend the northern frontier against the Manchu. When rebels reached the capital Beijing in 1644, he committed suicide, ending the Ming dynasty.
The Manchu formed the succeeding Qing dynasty.
The Manchu are an ethnic minority in China and the people from whom Manchuria derives its name. They are sometimes called "red-tasseled Manchus", a reference to the ornamentation on traditional Manchu hats. The Later Jin (1616–1636), and Qing dynasty (1636–1912) were established and ruled by Manchus, who are descended from the Jurchen people who earlier established the Jin dynasty (1115–1234) in China.
There's nothing about a flower within those dynasties I believe :P
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#79 posted Jun 13th 2020, 23:44:26
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#80 posted Jun 14th 2020, 09:22:35
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Quote ( Jun Ho @ June 11th 2020,23:13:06 ) There's nothing about a flower within those dynasties I believe :P
There should be something about a Lotus flower somewhere too. Lotus flowers were added, as a base for example, to many things. Just can't find an good old style succession. It's most legends and myths.
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#81 posted Jun 14th 2020, 09:54:38
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I was out last night & will go out again in an hour.
Someone found the answer. It's Anton Operations.
I'll have a look at how it checks out with all the clues.
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Quote ( Ahmet Sonverdi @ June 14th 2020,09:54:38 ) I was out last night & will go out again in an hour.
Someone found the answer. It's Anton Operations.
I'll have a look at how it checks out with all the clues.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Case_Anton
"Case Anton (German: Unternehmen Anton) was the military occupation of Vichy France carried out by Germany and Italy in November 1942. It marked the end of the Vichy regime as a nominally-independent state and the disbanding of its army (the severely-limited Armistice Army), but it continued its existence as a puppet government in Occupied France. One of the last actions of its armed forces before their dissolution was the scuttling of the French fleet in Toulon to prevent it from falling into Axis hands."
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#83 posted Jun 14th 2020, 11:31:34
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Quote ( Ahmet Sonverdi @ June 14th 2020,09:54:38 ) I was out last night & will go out again in an hour.
Someone found the answer. It's Anton Operations.
I'll have a look at how it checks out with all the clues.
What a brain buster.
I sat on the laptop searching all over the place to hopefully get all the dots lined up and couldn't even get close.
It's a good brain exercise that's for sure.....hard to imagine with info so readily available that simply searching google wont work.
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If it's not on the internet it doesn't exist. Well, before the GDPR at least.
"Anton Operations" returns "About 698 results (0,37 seconds)". And the quotation marks have an hard time to sort it out mixing results like "Anton's operations", "anton: Operations" and "Anton, Operations".
Just want to see how you put a flower on that.
I would ask for a rerun.
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#85 posted Jun 14th 2020, 11:55:40 (last edited Jun 14th 2020, 12:01:52 by Geir Pukk)
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Quote ( Jasper Coosemans @ June 11th 2020,00:38:27 ) I found a German general, Johannes Blaskowitz, who committed suicide and was later acquitted during the Nuremberg Trials. Maybe he oversaw some military operation that was initially named after some ruler/emperor from a wholly different historical era and then had a flower added to the name, I don't know. I didn't find anything. There is probably more than one general who fits the hints (suicide and acquitted)...
So Jasper was on the right track as Blaskowitz was the commander of the operation.
Did some digging with his name but somehow didn't find out about this operation.
Well thanks Ahmet for bringing this up, it was very interesting trying tosolve the problem. Any possibility of you posting the next ones when they pop up?
E: Can anyone also tell me how the flower clue links up with all of this?
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#86 posted Jun 14th 2020, 12:21:16
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Quote ( Geir Pukk @ June 14th 2020,11:55:40 )[ E: Can anyone also tell me how the flower clue links up with all of this?
i believe a rose has the name of Vichy in it
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#87 posted Jun 14th 2020, 12:43:23
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#88 posted Jun 14th 2020, 12:45:08
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Damn, we could have had this days ago if we (I) had tried a bit harder.
Case Anton is listed on Blaskowitz' Wiki as one of his battles, but I never checked it. The Wiki of Case Anton says: "Operation Anton updated the original Operation Attila, including different German units and adding Italian involvement."
The flower that was added, I'm not sure but it could be Operation Lila (is that close enough to 'lilac'?). Or somehow the additional involvement of the Italian army, or the occupation of Corsice can somehow be metaphorically called flowers, I don't know.
Atilla's father Mundzuk didn't rule the Huns, but maybe he was chief of some Hunnic tribe. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mundzuk
About Attila's predecessor Rugila (or Ruga), Wikipedia writes: "According to Socrates of Constantinople, Theodosius II prayed to God and managed to obtain what he sought - Ruga was struck dead by a thunderbolt."
As for the relative who died of gluttony, I have no idea.
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#89 posted Jun 14th 2020, 13:15:27
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Well, that Swedish king does have German relatives, so that just might be it
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#90 posted Jun 14th 2020, 13:45:12
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