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Fórum téma Szavazás
Shall we send them back to Rookie?
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Téma: Top 3 Punishment in Elite |
349 válasz
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It became norm to see such posts when manager fail. These managers then start to point finger to the game saying it is inbalanced (when they were winning game was perfectly balanced I guess because they are quite) or (as is this case) everyone is acting with collusion against these failed managers. I guess these people would also argue that humanity never went to the Moon and climate change cannot be manmade...
If you failed it has only one and only reason: You are not as good as others who finished higher. Now go and find way to get better.
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Quote ( Kevin Parkinson @ January 22nd 2017,20:12:26 ) So winners should be artificially kept from winning again How would this work? We would need a special "you seem to be trying to hard again" Police...to keep an eye on potential cheaters.
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Quote ( Kevin Parkinson @ January 22nd 2017,20:12:26 ) So winners should be artificially kept from winning again. We'll need to agree to disagree there. If they are the best that season, they should win. They should not be hampered just because they are the best.
Are they the best or can they write into other people's posts without punishment?
Quote ( Kevin Parkinson @ January 22nd 2017,20:12:26 ) You do realise that I am but a forum mod and absolutely nothing to do with the admin side of things? I'm not Vlad or Stefan so no idea why you keep accusing "me" of these things, because I shared my opinion (just like you shared yours).
This problem came partly from English language. You personally are part of GPRO Staff, which seems to be too conservative in some cases.
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I would think that instead of relegating the managers to rookie, you should give them a new driver of less than 100 overall to work with for the season.
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Quote ( Martin Rosina @ January 22nd 2017,20:25:35 ) It became norm to see such posts when manager fail. These managers then start to point finger to the game saying it is inbalanced (when they were winning game was perfectly balanced I guess because they are quite) or (as is this case) everyone is acting with collusion against these failed managers. I guess these people would also argue that humanity never went to the Moon and climate change cannot be manmade...
If you failed it has only one and only reason: You are not as good as others who finished higher. Now go and find way to get better.
I disagree.
According to some statistics, currently I am the 24th person who won the most titles. And, in a game, where the distribution of titles were better, this 24th place would mean 1 title, but if I played the game badly, then this 24th place should be owed by somebody else, not by me.
I won't argue that humanity never went to the Moon. Because it's a fact. :D
Seriously: nothing to do with that.
Climate changes took place in past history without human intervention. But this climate change can be based on our behaviour patterns. First cause can be that persuasion of mass of people is much harder than persuasion of one or two of them. Especially, if people current financial interests are against environmental protection. But I am not sure at all, if this would continue forever in the future.
Second cause can be that we are unsure about the future. But there will be a sure depletion if we don't do anything.
I suppose to have recognized some connections between pollution and the general refusal of multi-collusions here. People plan their Pro and Master promo seasons with -50 million $ balances here (from the season start), and they pollute and consume their non-renewable resources outta there, in the real life. Therefore, GPRO means much more for me, than a simple game. It's all about teaching other people that mutual effort is a valuable thing.
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You seriously need help Patrik
:(
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Am I a genius or a madman? The difference is quite little sometimes.
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I'll give you a little hint - you are definitely not the former....
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Quote ( Patrik Balogh @ January 23rd 2017,09:02:52 ) The difference is quite little sometimes.
And quite clear other times :p
Quote ( Patrik Balogh @ January 23rd 2017,06:54:46 ) Are they the best or can they write into other people's posts without punishment?
This is just laughable.
Do yourself a favour and go way back in the forums and find out why GPRO began. Find out what the issue was with the other game people played that encouraged Vlad and the like to breakaway to build a fairer game.
To insinuate that people are only champions because they are part of the crew is laughable in its premise and, furthermore, has no basis in fact. How many crew members have been Elite champions? Or even top 4 in Elite in recent seasons (you can check that in your own opening post!)
You either need to stop listening to those pushing a false agenda or just make sure you get yourself a good quality foil hat!
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Quote ( Kevin Parkinson @ January 23rd 2017,09:06:12 ) Do yourself a favour and go way back in the forums and find out why GPRO began. Find out what the issue was with the other game people played that encouraged Vlad and the like to breakaway to build a fairer game.
Got it, Stefan Voggenreither clearly told it in his Quixotic Press interview. And that's why I will leave this game (among other reasons), because I don't feel if you would have entirely right, at least in this moment.
This is proved by that, in any ideal case, the GPRO Staff should stand beside me. In any other case...not.
Quote ( Robin Goodey @ January 23rd 2017,09:05:14 ) I'll give you a little hint - you are definitely not the former....
Well, current situation is the next: there is an imagined world, where a certain group of persons accuses an other group of persons that they are sick. The other group of persons do the same with the first group. Meanwhile, somebody from an either group [Florencia Caro] writes to the Facebook page of the game that 'GPRO is life'.
The question: is real life good or not?
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#311 Elküldve: 2017. január 23. 09:36:16 (módosítva: 2017. január 23. 09:47:29 Luke Frost által)
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I voted the last one.
#Conspiracy
Enjoying the reading here.
While I agree the sponsor cartel is a problem in elite -- and I've seen many deserving players get shuffled out of the group because the top managers have the majority of all available sponsors in the group at 80% or more --I don't think they should be punished. Instead, something should be done about it which allows more opportunities for the mid-field to earn as much income.
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Patrick, maybe a language thing, but totally don't understand the point you are making in the first paragraph above. Maybe you could explain better?
Also, you didn't answer my question about Crew members winning Elite. You implied there is bias towards them, so please show us all the evidence.
Your point about "two groups" is the type of mantra I only hear by people trying to create issues that don't exist. People with similar thoughts may agree with each other a lot of the time, but not all the time. To try and clump everyone together in two separate "groups" betrays the fact that everyone is individual and has their own opinions. This thread actually shows this fairly well. Many will disagree with your conspiracy theory ideas, but if you go back to talk of making a better sponsor system then many more, quite possibly a majority, would agree.
On that very point, how did talk of making a better sponsor system turn in to unfounded conspiracy theories about the game's admin being biased against you? :/
Given your path to Elite, I assume you must be fairly intelligent so I'd advise you to use that intelligence. Take a step back, evaluate what you're now claiming and think what is valid and what is not.
IMO, there is no point worrying about "sponsor cartel" in Elite. It's questionable if it exists anyway and would it be any different to an Amateur manager encouraging people to not waste time on a sponsor he is favourite to win (which I have seen and I have done myself)? What could be beneficial is a change to the sponsor system to give mid-pack managers a better chance to sign some sponsors, obviously not the top ones.
Maybe link sponsor progress to expected results per sponsor and not simply best results? A sponsor expecting mid-pack could progress faster with a mid-pack manager compared to someone winning the race.
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Quote ( Kevin Parkinson @ January 23rd 2017,10:04:43 ) Maybe link sponsor progress to expected results per sponsor and not simply best results? A sponsor expecting mid-pack could progress faster with a mid-pack manager compared to someone winning the race.
+1
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I have no real evidences. If we consider that 'real evidences' are kind of 'X and Y managers logged in from the same computer'.
But, if we see these links:
/gb/forum/Search.asp?slInForum=&txtAuthor=Michael+Winkle...
Just waiting for Roland Postle and Matt Kasar to disprove it.
Well unfortunately, we saw this post 3 days ago: /gb/forum/ViewTopic.asp?TopicId=26476&PostId=4075849#post4075849 - and whose style of typing in it. And whose style of typing in usual in Matt's posts.
The fact that Vlad and Stefan didn't change the sponsor system significantly, can be enough proof from their part.
I heard that Rafael Mantovani had been an ex-crew member. In my opinion, no ex-crew members should be allowed to start playing.
I got a PM from an experienced forum person here:
"In the old days, there used to be a thing called the Manager Reviewal Committee (MRC) it got uncovered, and I posted a lot about it, but many of those old posts have been deleted. It used to be Mark Webster, Toni Metsankyla, and other such people who were friendly with the admins. They got inormation on game changes far earlier than other people."
If we see who was favoured by the introduced driver energy in season 55; then I see 2 suspicious names, who broke into the Elite top 10 in last season. They are Florencia Caro (a community manager, whose role is uncertain) and Rafael Mantovani.
When won a national team a personal title at last? Joao (or Joana) Monteiro and Frederico Neves? Quite in the past.
It's obvious that Jukka Sireni can disagree with me, because he works with the admins on the new live race screen, and theoretically he shouldn't play at the same time.
Speaking about DA-punishments:
1) I have heard that Mark Webster had a DA and he was allowed to continue without any punishment.
2) Eduard Gindullin had a DA and he got 5 races penalty.
3) As I said, somebody is allowed to care even his DA.
4) I deeply regret that there is not any explicit rule to the case of double- or multi-accounts. If the purpose was similar in the beginning, this should have been the first rule at the start of GPRO.
5) We speak about a sport (or as it is advertised on the Facebook page). In my opinion, if we speak about a sport, we should care about equal punishments for equal debts.
I am not convinced if it is entirely right what I'm saying. But, if only the half of it is right, that's a sad thing.
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So this thread went from sponsor collusion in Elite to finger pointing and throwing accusations with no clear evidence..... Just saying.
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Quote ( Patrik Balogh @ January 23rd 2017,11:05:37 ) But, if we see these links:
/gb/forum/Search.asp?slInForum=&txtAuthor=Michael+Winkle...
What has relevance of Winkley mentioning Roland got to do with anything? I'm missing your point and how it is relevant to some kind of conspiracy or preferential treatment for crew members.
Quote ( Patrik Balogh @ January 23rd 2017,11:05:37 ) Well unfortunately, we saw this post 3 days ago: /gb/forum/ViewTopic.asp?TopicId=26476&PostId=4075849#post4075849 - and whose style of typing in it. And whose style of typing in usual in Matt's posts.
You've lost me again. What has Matt's opinion got to do with you accusing there being some kind of conspiracy or preferential treatment for crew members.
Quote ( Patrik Balogh @ January 23rd 2017,11:05:37 ) The fact that Vlad and Stefan didn't change the sponsor system significantly, can be enough proof from their part.
They haven't changed the sponsor system is proof of preferential treatment for some? What? How?!
There are many reasons they may have decided not to change the sponsor system (and I'm not privy to the internal thinking of Vlad's mind so could only speculate as to why, be it he's happy with it or isn't happy with any proposed change, I don't know), but as it has been unchanged since the start of the game, I fail to see how you can claim it is deliberately biased towards anyone as all started on the same playing field, surely. And many weren't even playing back then that have since been multiple time champions. So how can a system that was in place before people started playing be biased towards individuals that the admin choose it to be biased towards??!
Now, I'm not saying the sponsor system is perfect - I don't believe it is, but to claim not changing it is any kind of evidence of anything is a total logic fail. It makes no sense!
Quote ( Patrik Balogh @ January 23rd 2017,11:05:37 ) I heard that Rafael Mantovani had been an ex-crew member. In my opinion, no ex-crew members should be allowed to start playing.
Rafa was always playing before he was a forum mod, during his time being a forum mod and after he stopped being a forum mod. And he was only ever a forum mod. Are you claiming no forum moderator should be allowed to play the game? Again, nonsense, surely?! Shall we ban those that give up their time to help moderate the individual language topics too? How about those that do translations for the site?
You really have to realise that while the crew consists of people like the forum mods, and there are people that help or have helped with picture approval, for example, only the admins themselves have any information about the inner workings of the game. No one that has access to this should be an active player, and it is the case that no one does.
Quote ( Patrik Balogh @ January 23rd 2017,11:05:37 ) If we see who was favoured by the introduced driver energy in season 55; then I see 2 suspicious names, who broke into the Elite top 10 in last season. They are Florencia Caro (a community manager, whose role is uncertain) and Rafael Mantovani.
So Flo, FORMER community manager who has anything to do with the internal workings of the game and Rafa, who quite publicly had clear issues with the admin of the game around the time he was removed from his role as forum mod, so not on particularly friendly terms with them, are getting preferential treatment? Erm, why? And why isn't Mick Ridley, for example? Or any of those that help behind the scenes and work more actively with the admins on a day to day basis (but again, not to do with the internal workings of the game, as anyone privy to this would not be allowed to play the game!).
I can't see why either of they people breaking in to the top 10 in Elite would be unusual. Look at their manager history and the teams they are part of. If they had never had different colour stars, would you find it just as suspicious? Of course you wouldn't.
You're creating a conspiracy theory to explain something that doesn't need explaining. It's laughable.
Quote ( Patrik Balogh @ January 23rd 2017,11:05:37 ) Speaking about DA-punishments:
DA stuff is clearly a different matter, and I'm lost to why you bring it up here or what relevance it has to what we are discussing. I can neither confirm or deny what you've heard as I simply don't know. Dealing with DAs is a Shadow/Admin issue and I'm not privy to any information that isn't in the public domain. But, I see no relevance to it here so this isn't the topic to discuss such things.
---
What is more likely, Patrik - a massive conspiracy theory with admins helping people they have no particular reason to want to help (and no clear way of how they are helping them) or the best managers in the best teams (so learning from other great managers) are doing well?
The only decent point this thread brings up is that sponsors could be doing with being changed somehow, especially in Elite, but even that is only an opinion that not all agree with (as previously mentioned, I do support a change as I described in my last post).
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#317 Elküldve: 2017. január 23. 14:41:13 (módosítva: 2017. január 23. 14:44:57 Jon Day által)
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What about those Aliens eh? There must be some out there somewhere.Quote ( Fernando Garcia @ January 23rd 2017,14:05:31 ) So this thread went from sponsor collusion in Elite to finger pointing and throwing accusations with no clear evidence..... Just saying. Just thought I'd take it to the next level :P
Quote ( Patrik Balogh @ January 23rd 2017,11:05:37 ) I heard that Rafael Mantovani had been an ex-crew member. In my opinion, no ex-crew members should be allowed to start playing. I wouldnt trust that Rafa bloke either Patrik...He has shifty eyes!
Quote ( Patrik Balogh @ January 23rd 2017,11:05:37 ) I deeply regret that there is not any explicit rule to the case of double- or multi-accounts This from a Hungarian! Obviously I'm not suggesting anything by that comment....I just thought it worth pointing out. ;-)
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Quote ( Fernando Garcia @ January 23rd 2017,14:05:31 ) So this thread went from sponsor collusion in Elite to finger pointing and throwing accusations with no clear evidence..... Just saying.
In a scientific world, references are accepted.
Quote ( Jon Day @ January 23rd 2017,14:41:13 ) I wouldnt trust that Rafa bloke either Patrik...He has shifty eyes!
And sharp teeths, LOL
Quote ( Jon Day @ January 23rd 2017,14:41:13 ) This from a Hungarian! Obviously I'm not suggesting anything by that comment....I just thought it worth pointing out. ;-)
Hungarian Crowns are not DAs. Ask Keeney, former hater of HCs.
We organized our own multi-collusion about Hungarian players.
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Quote ( Patrik Balogh @ January 23rd 2017,14:42:30 ) In a scientific world, references are accepted.
Don't go insulting the science world, or you will get my back up :p
"References" are absolutely not evidence and not "accepted" as such! Correlation does not imply causation!!
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#320 Elküldve: 2017. január 23. 14:47:48 (módosítva: 2017. január 23. 14:51:39 Jon Day által)
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Quote ( Kevin Parkinson @ January 23rd 2017,14:45:49 ) "References" are absolutely not evidence and not "accepted" as such! Correlation does not imply causation!! This from a Scotsman! I rest my case. :P
Quote ( Patrik Balogh @ January 23rd 2017,14:42:30 ) Hungarian Crowns are not DAs. I never suggested they were. I would want proof before saying such a thing...and as 1. Have no proof and 2. I really cant be arsed...it would be wrong of me to post otherwise.
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Ever since this thread appeared, I started reading Hungarian Crown as "Hungarian Clown".
Not suggesting that you all have round red noses btw.
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Quote ( Patrik Balogh @ January 23rd 2017,07:41:45 ) I disagree.
According to some statistics, currently I am the 24th person who won the most titles. And, in a game, where the distribution of titles were better, this 24th place would mean 1 title, but if I played the game badly, then this 24th place should be owed by somebody else, not by me.
Don't get me wrong. By all metrics you're good manager. Better then vast vast majority. By failing I was referring to your own expectations. You expected to be champion by this time but this didn't happen (so far) so you are understandably disappointed. I get it. But this is quite possible the worst way how to handle it (by pointing to others and game itself).
I was racing in Elite for couple of seasons. Do you know why I didn't win a title? Because I was weaker than others. I just need to get better and that is it. I'm not trying to change game, I'm not saying others are in collusion against me or whatever. It is my fault and no one's else. Why I'm so sure about this? Because in this game every manager has exactly the same options. All the difference in race results is an outcome of how manager uses these options.
If you want to win a title I strongly urge you stop whining and instead think what Elite champs are doing better then you. It worked for Hladik, Leandro, Postle, Aareskoskis and practically all champs.
Beautiful thing about this approach is that it is nicely transferable to real life where it will make you vastly more successful. Many many great champs in every sport used this approach...
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Quote ( Miel Soeterbroek @ January 23rd 2017,15:06:10 ) Not suggesting that you all have round red noses Or own McDonalds franchises?
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You need over 300 posts to turn this discussion into da hunt? Very poor :D
stay on topic please. As far as i remember topic was about alliens responsibility about climate changes
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Quote ( Daneks Britāls @ January 23rd 2017,20:06:37 ) As far as i remember topic was about alliens responsibility about climate changes
For real..
How is everyone not talking about this?
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Quote ( Rocco Stallone @ January 23rd 2017,20:09:55 ) How is everyone not talking about this? Clearly a conspiracy!
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Play nice please, gentleman. If you don't have anything to add to the conversation, there are plenty other threads to post in :)
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Quote ( Kevin Parkinson @ January 23rd 2017,20:47:40 ) If you don't have anything to add to the conversation
I have but i'm affraid of you mate :)
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Ah I see the division, 27 likes and 29 dislikes.
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